"Language." "Nng, sorry..."

[prog]

So babies & toddlers are starting to inevitably spread through my social group, and are being brought to gaming events, which serve as the mead-halls for my social life. This much is fine. I like kids OK, and I like smart kids a lot, so I honestly look forward to this crop getting old enough to think and talk, so I can start feeling jealous for their awesome childhoods within a whole crowd of delightfully immature "aunts" & "uncles". (Versus that of poor baby jmac, raised by friendless oldsters and sent to bed at 6pm every night. Alas!)

But there is one thing I don't like so much: it's accepted that, when the wee ones are around, all the grown-ups must refrain from using cuss-words. This actually makes me a little annoyed. Actually: rather annoyed, and a little angry, that I must constrain my own behavior for reasons which, when I think them through, seem more harmful than beneficial to the kids in question.

I mean: beyond being a futile exercise (you do plan on sending them to school one day, yes?), it smacks of teaching one's children a known falsehood, setting them up for later disillusionment and confusion. I guess I could see it if we as a group truly abused the words to a nautical degree, but I would argue that we use them as proper language flavoring: salt rather than syrup, if you will. So wouldn't one want to expose their kids to smart grown-ups speaking naturally, rather than teach them the fiction that the words simply don't exist, and are never said by anyone?

Naturally, I say all this as a non-parent, and further one who can't imagine changing this status, not without a rather severe personal mental rearrangement, so maybe there's something magical I'm not getting. Furthermore, were I ever put in charge of a child, I would (barring, again, a drastic change of personal philosophy) teach them during their first sentient Xmas the truth about both Santa Claus and Jesus Christ, and I don't know how different this strategy would be from even the new parents in my current crowd.

Comments

[ruthling.livejournal.com]

I don't have strong opinions on the language issue. I think I swear too much sometimes and it makes me look stupid, petty and inarticulate, so I sometimes appreciate that little nudge of maybe this isn't the place. Its good exercise in situational behavior, which *is* something people need to teach to kids. I don't think finding out that there are good and bad places to swear is any worse than finding out there are good and bad places to scream and run around, and if we can't get that, it's tough to teach by example.

As a data point, since I grew up Jewish in a very non-Jewish locale (at the time, what's happened since is a bit odd), my parents did sit me down my first "sentient" Christmas and explain the whole Santa Claus thing to me. They also warned me that my friends wouldn't maybe be so eager for me to spoil things for them, so I should keep it to myself. So far, I've grown up to be an intellectually snobby atheist who hates people. Your mileage may vary. :)

[prog.livejournal.com]

I don't think finding out that there are good and bad places to swear is any worse than finding out there are good and bad places to scream and run around, and if we can't get that, it's tough to teach by example.

But my argument is that this blanket policy is teaching kids that there are never good places to swear, which just ain't true. I understand how tricky this is, because a kid actually has to be pretty old before understanding of linguistic subtlety can settle in. Until then I'd imagine a kid with knowledge of a few zingers will experiment at inserting them into different situations and seeing the reactions these get, often to the embarrassment of the parents.

Counterargument: the parents shouldn't feel embarrassed at their kids learning how to speak properly (though they should absolutely take corrective action at mistakes like this).

[ruthling.livejournal.com]

Most kids learn the appropriate times to swear: while doing a home improvement project, watching professional sports or politics, etc. Better to learn some stuff at home. I'm not gonna toilet train my friends' kids either.

[jadelennox]

Gotta agree with ruthling. For me, it's less about the kids, and more about me taking advantage of the opportunity to train myself out of habit that I feel makes me look illiterate.