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Aug. 21st, 2004 09:00 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
progAfter letting it incubate for a week, I have a better idea of what one of my more complicated issues with Spider-Man 2 was. It's an issue I have only because Spider-Man -- and super-hero mythology in general -- was a major figure in my personal development, and I found the movie to play kind of loose with one rather important super-hero concept.
I really didn't like how Spidey removes or otherwise loses his mask in the company of others no less than three times. Read in what symbolism of adolescent fears that you will (and you wouldn't be incorrect), but superheroes are terrified of being unmasked, in part because it violently changes the relationship between them and the people who see. As a result, an unmasking is usually a rare and major plot development (assuming that there are no magic forgetting-drugs applied to the characters, or alternate-timeline-jumping, or whatever; in the Marvel universe that sort of crap happens all the time).
In the movie, though, Spidey loses his mask, in order of increasing ?!-ness, to Doc Ock (big deal; like all movie-adapted comic book villains, he (probably) snuffs it at the end, which also ticks me off but that's a different bag of apples) and at the same time to MJ (GAH, this is the sort of thing that happens only after YEARS of story development in the comics... which, granted, we sort of had, with the understood two-year lag in movie-time between the two movies (which I also thought was kind of neat)), and before that to Harry (same complaint as with MJ) and at some point to a bunch of civilians on a train (GAAAAAH... now, I bet this has happened in the comics, just as it happened in the movie... maybe a little ways into the series, when Stan Lee was writing it, only to be quickly forgotten about (until, 15 or 30 real-time years later, the series' current writer gets the idea to start a small plot arc involving one of those people, who perhaps has had a change of heart)).
Note that I parenthetically excused all of these unmaskings. I think one or maybe even two of them would have been acceptable to me. But all of them, all at once... it was a bit much, taking an important super-hero concept and just setting it to overload like that. It really did bother me, and I think made me much more grouchy about the film's other, rather minor flaws.
In other news, there were no Elves at Helm's Deep. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go finish polishing the custom bases for my Secret Wars action figure collection.
I really didn't like how Spidey removes or otherwise loses his mask in the company of others no less than three times. Read in what symbolism of adolescent fears that you will (and you wouldn't be incorrect), but superheroes are terrified of being unmasked, in part because it violently changes the relationship between them and the people who see. As a result, an unmasking is usually a rare and major plot development (assuming that there are no magic forgetting-drugs applied to the characters, or alternate-timeline-jumping, or whatever; in the Marvel universe that sort of crap happens all the time).
In the movie, though, Spidey loses his mask, in order of increasing ?!-ness, to Doc Ock (big deal; like all movie-adapted comic book villains, he (probably) snuffs it at the end, which also ticks me off but that's a different bag of apples) and at the same time to MJ (GAH, this is the sort of thing that happens only after YEARS of story development in the comics... which, granted, we sort of had, with the understood two-year lag in movie-time between the two movies (which I also thought was kind of neat)), and before that to Harry (same complaint as with MJ) and at some point to a bunch of civilians on a train (GAAAAAH... now, I bet this has happened in the comics, just as it happened in the movie... maybe a little ways into the series, when Stan Lee was writing it, only to be quickly forgotten about (until, 15 or 30 real-time years later, the series' current writer gets the idea to start a small plot arc involving one of those people, who perhaps has had a change of heart)).
Note that I parenthetically excused all of these unmaskings. I think one or maybe even two of them would have been acceptable to me. But all of them, all at once... it was a bit much, taking an important super-hero concept and just setting it to overload like that. It really did bother me, and I think made me much more grouchy about the film's other, rather minor flaws.
In other news, there were no Elves at Helm's Deep. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go finish polishing the custom bases for my Secret Wars action figure collection.
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i saw it for free, and i am thankful for that
Date: 2004-08-21 07:47 pm (UTC)1) i found the obvious jesus imagery irritating. this may explain why i think the matrix is stupid.
2) while i liked the complexity alfred molina brought to doc ock, everyone else was fairly one dimensional. i think MJ needs to be dropped off a building, braless and clad in a wet dress, and aunt may needs to shut her pie hole. two minutes into her speech about needing spiderman when the neighbor kid was helping her pack we ALL got it, ok, but she kept talking and beating poor peter and us the audience soundly about the head and neck with her 'we all need heroes bit.'
3) when the neighbor chippy offered chocolate cake to peter, she actually served yellow.
4) i also had a hard time, given the trash dude was willing to sell the spidey outfit, believing the strangers on the train wouldn't say anything about PP being unmasked. i will admit i chuckled with glee when they were all like "you have to get through us" and Doc O was like "ok."
5) i heart ted raimi
6) why was aunt mae having so many money problems? couldn't supah model MJ or richer than thou harry throw her a freakin bone?
7) yes, the life of a super hero is hard. but i found the constant cosmic crapping on poor peter's head to be way over the top, which effectively killed any sympathy i had for the poor schmoe. insert more eye rolling here.
that said, i think the development of harry vs peter, goblin vs spidey set up for the third film could actually be interesting. i think 2 propelled the story forward, but took too many side trips into sentimental drivel and lacked the complex storytelling so evident in the first one.
Re: i saw it for free, and i am thankful for that
Date: 2004-08-21 09:57 pm (UTC)I, too, found the all of the unmaskings to be a bit unnerving for a regular Spidey fan.
My other grumble is that he really didn't have all that many snappy come-back lines and distracting patter during the fights, which was a staple in the comics.
Re: i saw it for free, and i am thankful for that
Date: 2004-08-21 10:05 pm (UTC)Re: i saw it for free, and i am thankful for that
Date: 2004-08-21 11:01 pm (UTC)Re: i saw it for free, and i am thankful for that
Date: 2004-08-22 09:19 am (UTC)5) Ted Raimi rocks. So does Bruce Campbell.
7) Goodgod it was like reading a Steven Dondaldson novel. Misery. Angst. Stomping on of emotions. I got tired of it about half the way into the movie.
Has anyone in NYC NOT seen Spiderman's face? Seriously.
Re: i saw it for free, and i am thankful for that
Date: 2004-08-22 09:21 pm (UTC)